Using fiber-optic camera adapters to incorporate large image sensor digital cinema cameras into live multicamera production
See how fiber-optic camera backs and adapters allow you to incorporate large-image-sensor digital cinema cameras into live multicamera productions.
Fiber-optic-based transport systems for broadcast, cable, satellite, production, digital cinema, surveillance, teleconferencing, and Pro-AV applications.
See the latest SilverBack Fiber Optic Camera Backs at NAB.
Please download and watch all three parts of or Best of Live Production at NAB Series
Best of Live Production at NAB from Haivision AVIWEST, Part 1 [Recording Download]
Jim Jachetta (00:02):
Jesse Foster (00:14):
Excellent, Jim, thank you.
Jim Jachetta (00:17):
So, my colleague, Rick and I, we spoke to a lot of customers, either via text or on the phone. And it seemed like a lot of people couldn’t come to the NAB Show because they were working, they were busy, which I felt was a good sign. There were those people that, I’m concerned about my health, et cetera. And I don’t blame, you got health concerns, coming into a public show like NAB, but I would say a good third of the people were like, “I’m in the middle of a production. I’m building a new studio. I can’t get away,” which I think is good. People are getting back to work. I’m hoping things are getting back to normal. So how was NAB for you guys? What was your takeaway?
Jesse Foster (01:05):
Yeah, so we got a booth later in the scheme of things, and it was in the central hall near all of our partner companies like Canon and Panasonic and Sony, which is what we always aim for. So we had great booth meetings, a lot of pre-qualified, pre-vetted discussions that they just want to get some more detail, meet us in person, see the product in person. So the takeaway between my colleague and I that were there was fewer tire kickers, fewer people, so you got to focus on in depth discussions and really get some stuff accomplished. So it was probably the best NAB I’ve ever had in regards to actual detailed discussions with end users who are ready to buy. And it was really great. It was not busy. Load in, load out. Everything was really low key in me. So we had a great NAB with that said.
Jim Jachetta (02:11):
Yeah, hopefully that’s a new normal. And of course, no MultiDyne or VidOvation customers are tire kickers. Those are somebody else’s customers. Ours are never tire kickers. But I know what you mean. Some people come to NAB, it’s like a mini vacation. From the vendor perspective, we want someone who’s got an active project. We want to help solve their problem. But then, even those people that are just checking out what’s new, we engage so they’re aware of us when they’re ready for a project. I think I stopped by your booth a couple of times, and you guys were busy enough where you couldn’t talk to me for more than a few minutes, and I thought that was a good problem to have.
Jim Jachetta (02:59):
So the main theme of this is a live production, but the subheading Live Production NAB, but the theme is like what people missed for those people that either if they were there and didn’t get a chance to come to your booth or people that couldn’t make it out, give them the MultiDyne overview. I think the hot thing though is the cinematic cameras, working a cinematic camera into a broadcast workflow. I know you’ve done it with a couple of churches and that’s a big thing. Everyone wants the cinematic look now. Is that the trend?
Jesse Foster (03:39):
Exactly. Yeah. So this presentation, I’ll primarily focus on the semi live aspect of our portfolio, but I do have a couple slides just to highlight the overall range of products that you would’ve seen if you were at the show. I mean, the industry’s been hurdling towards this point for a few years now where cinema cameras manufacturers have their eye on using those types of products in live multi-cam productions. So they’ve enhanced them to accept external timecode and genlock, the different signal types that you would need to have a multi-cam live production. So those are in place on the camera side. And then on the consumer side, the monitor, the televisions are all wide color gamut, high contrast ratio 4K up to AK high frame rate, so those consumer displays are causing demand for content.
Jesse Foster (04:40):
So it’s all coming together and culminating in a very exciting time for MultiDyne, with our range of fiber optic camera adapters. So that’s what we’ll get into here right now is what we’re doing in that space, and who’s working with us, and who we’re working with and so forth. So that said the start of the show in that regard is the SilverBack V, here you see it on a Sony Venice camera, and let’s jump in here. The product has been designed in a way that it is platform agnostic. And this is snapshot of the main camera platforms we work with. But based on the design, it can most likely accommodate pretty much anything you run into, or you can use a different version of our products, which I’ll show you that you could build this type of workflow using different form factor products from us.
Jesse Foster (05:42):
So what we’re doing is we’re leveraging the SMPTE hybrid fiber specification. This cable type is used in broadcast television systems for 20 plus years. So if you go with a Panasonic or Sony [inaudible 00:05:58] Hitachi studio camera system, it’s going to have a base station, a CCU component, and the camera, and it has this interconnection umbilical cable that is this SMPTE hybrid spec here. So it has two single mode fibers in it. It has two power conductors, and then also some low voltage signaling conductors as well. This is what we’re doing to turn a cinema camera into a TV studio camera is using this fiber, and there’s ways also to not have to use this fiber as well, which I’ll show you, but this is really the enabling infrastructure layer that allows us to make a cinema camera operate like a television camera.
Jesse Foster (06:44):
Fiber optics is really the key. So just a couple recent use case pictures. The halftime show at this year’s Super Bowl was shot with Sony VENICE cameras and the SilverBack V. There was a range of these systems in play and our partners at Funicular Goats put this together and they own a wide range of these. So these are really popular in rentals and production companies because rentals, you could take a digital film camera that’s used for documentary style production, slap this silver bag B on the bag of it, and you have a live broadcast camera. And they could take it from Harry just tell me it was very flexible in that regard. So this was a real great opportunity for us to work with these guys and it worked flawlessly for them. They love it.
Jesse Foster (07:42):
So you can see this is going to start rolling out across the board trucks, OB trucks, Flypacks, going to continue to build out with digital cinema camera front end into the broadcast workflow. So the next, so this is a few weeks ago, and these are images of our product in our partners boots. So this is a RED V-Raptor in Digital Glues booth, and they actually worked with a partner company to come up with a B4 as an RF lens mount on the RED, and then they have a B4 adapter. So the value there is you can use B4 mount broadcast lenses on this digital film camera for low cost quick let’s make TV with the lenses we have. So that’s a big thing. They were a big hit at the show with that said, so that’s the SilverBack on the back of a low cost, very high quality, but lower cost camera body over here on the right hand side, we have a VariCam LT Panasonic.
Jesse Foster (08:56):
Here’s the Sony Venice in the able Cine booth. And then here’s a Sony FX9 with the SilverBack on the back. And these two are used in productions together simultaneously, because they share the same color science. So we’ve done productions where some of the key positions have the Venice and then some of the ancillary positions have FX9s, so extremely diverse deployment that we’ve had and it continues to grow. And then as mentioned that I didn’t put it in the slides here, but Skaarhoj does RCP panels, universal control systems and whatnot, and they have a really cool Casper. The owner has a video on YouTube and then he did a flyer at the show that was representative of the project we did with Saddleback Church, the Lake Forest that used the Red Komodo and the SilverBack, and the Fuji lenses and the Skaarhoj for control.
Jesse Foster (10:01):
So they actually had Iris control from Skaarhoj going through us through Ethernet, through serial, through the lens. So our infrastructure that we put in when it comes to the connectivity, which I have some slides that’ll show is just like a building platform for people to develop these advanced workflows, like serial data, Ethernet, contact closures all the different signal types you would need to build the system are in place in the SilverBack. So it’s really limitless in what people can do with innovation. So the next one here, this is TV Pro Gear. They do Flypacks and this is their latest version of FlyPacks. And you see three base stations in here. So this is the SilverBack V Base Station, each 2 RU box does two channels. So this is a six digital cinema camera Flypack that these two cameras here were connected to that Flypack showing the diversity of connectivity that you can get through our system.
Jesse Foster (11:10):
You can use whatever camera you want, basically. And then this is one that I like to show I was on site for this. This is a pre pandemic 2020 Cinematographer Awards, where we actually did [inaudible 00:11:25] with SilverBack Vs. And then we used our juiceboxes, which essentially eliminate that hybrid fiber and then take you to single mode fiber. So you can run through an infrastructure that doesn’t have the hybrid fiber. So just a standard single mode, tactical fiber through the Hollywood and Highland venue down to the street, down to the truck. So this is like a common use case for our customers where you go hybrid fibers. So this box sends power to the camera and then it converts that to single mode, and then you can run 10 kilometers across the campus or whatever you need to do.
Jesse Foster (12:04):
So this was a fun one. So that was the cinema Congress award Show shot with cinema cameras for the first time, which is very cool. So just to jump into the product quickly, OLED display has metering shows you timecode, genlock presence, data presence shows you your video format, detected power status, very user friendly. You got your menu Control Buttons, you got Intercom Talk Buttons. So that’s another thing that we bring that makes a digital cinema camera into a studio camera is Intercom, two channels of Intercom and program audio that you can select. And if you find your Switch and Status, so this is a way to switch to an external monitor and it emulates a TV camera where you can see return video coming from the switcher, and you can see your own view finder and switch between the two on the same monitor like you can on a broadcast camera.
Jesse Foster (13:01):
So it’s value add there. And then we also support V Mount or Gold Mount. So again, that’s that flexibility that allows us to work with any cameras type. So you can go V Mount to go to a Sony directly, and if you use Anton Bauer batteries, then you can have Anton Bauer batteries on the battery side. On the Connector Panel side, these our SMPTE 304M that’s a designation of that connector, 311 M is the fiber itself. We also support Neutrik opticalCON. So if you were a Neutrik house, you could go that as opposed to the [inaudible 00:13:39]. So this version is 4K capable. So you have a 12G163G on the first input, dual 6G capability for like [inaudible 00:13:50] mirror 4K, it uses dual 6G to get off the camera body.
Jesse Foster (13:54):
So that’s what you would do there. Or if you had a Quad link camera like an F 55 or something that was relegated to Quad link or a C 700 from can or something. This product can handle all those, and in most cases convert in the transport. If you give us Quad link, we can give you 12G on the output and vice versa. So 3GIO, we give you additional video back and forth for return and witness cameras, all different kinds of use cases come up for it. But this is switchable view finder IO. So here’s your multiple serial datas. So this is good for that Fuji lens control I was just talking about, or even see motion, FIZ Focus, Iris, Zoom servos, and this control can go over that data connection. And then we have that full gigabit Ethernet for you as well.
Jesse Foster (14:46):
The genlock bi-level or tri-level, your Timecode, 2 Mic Level Inputs back to the Base Station, 4X4 Audio by directional. So you can do scratch tracks and lay down audio on the camera, record at camera, send and return audio, and your headset, and then the contact closures and [inaudible 00:15:09]. Jump into the base station side, you have two systems in one, like I mentioned, you got your power supply status, and control and jump to the back.
Jesse Foster (15:20):
Sorry, my animation drew me there. So here’s your limo camera one, camera two, you have two power supplies. This box has redundant power. And then this power supplies for camera one, this power supplies for camera two internally. And it really mirrors the IO that was on the camera side with the exception that we have more real estate. So this is like a proper task cam D 88 style pin out. And then this Intercom [inaudible 00:15:47] is standard to Sony and Panasonic. So it’s industry standard pin out there. Two data connections here and everything else you saw on the camera side. The other thing to note here is there’s a web browser internally, an SD card for preset saving or recalls and firmware upgrades, and there’s also opengear slots. So…
Jim Jachetta (16:14):
That’s the coolest part.
Jesse Foster (16:15):
Yeah. It really is. I mean, considering that the solutions are evolving in their own realm, like partner companies we work with have 3D-LUT processing of 4K to HD down conversion, you could do 4K multi viewing the SMPTE 2110 gateway. It’s really [crosstalk 00:16:36]
Jim Jachetta (16:36):
Yeah. That’s what I was going to say. You read my mind 2110 card that doesn’t exist yet. You just pop it in there in the future.
Jesse Foster (16:42):
Yeah. I mean, there’s even solutions out there now on the market from our open gear partners that we can put in there that we’re working with them on now. So the beauty of that is one monolithic box, put it in, has your full camera connectivity and put you on the 2110 network at the same time. [crosstalk 00:17:00] So at a high level this is what we had at the cinematographer’s guild, essentially, where you have single mode fiber running to the juice box, and then the juice powers to the camera doctor and the camera. But I like to slide just because it shows at a high level, all the connectivity that’s going in and out of this system over one fiber bidirectional-
Jim Jachetta (17:30):
That’s amazing. I think you got every possible signal covered there Jesse. I…
Jesse Foster (17:37):
There’s a few on my list, but yeah, this covers 99% of what we run into. So…
Jim Jachetta (17:43):
That is awesome.
Jesse Foster (17:45):
Let’s see. And then-
Jim Jachetta (17:47):
So I think I’ve asked you this question before. So the juicebox is the bridge between the SMPTE hybrid cable to longer haul fiber?
Jesse Foster (17:58):
Jim Jachetta (18:00):
So you had that at a midway point, injecting power to the camera maybe behind stage, and then the truck or fiber could go to the studio 10,000 miles away. Is that the idea?
Jesse Foster (18:14):
Well, this distance limited in the regard that it’s dark fiber tech, because we’re using CW-
Jim Jachetta (18:23):
Oh, right. So you’d have to have a dark fiber to go long haul-
Jesse Foster (18:27):
Yeah. And then it would have to be DWDM and you could amplify or whatever, but this stuff is mostly like 10 kilometer distance without amplification or regeneration.
Jim Jachetta (18:39):
But so the yellow park could be the infrastructure in a ballpark, say for example, and then the rack is in a truck or in the truck bay, and then you’re only going a couple 100 feet with the SMPTE cable from the juice device in the middle to the camera. Is that it?
Jesse Foster (18:55):
Yeah, exactly. This could be 10 kilometers and this could be about a kilometer.
Jim Jachetta (19:02):
Jesse Foster (19:03):
Cool. So this is coming shortly. A new board that we have for the SilverBack is Quad 12 G. So I think we’re a little early in regards to what cameras are out there that are doing 8K off the camera body using Quad 12 G the initial ones are probably some proprietary connectivity or HDMI 2.1. But when these come around it’s really just like Quad 3G, constituted 4K, Quad 12 G will constitute AK, so we have it ready to go. And then this is a little sneak peek here on the open gear side, cross compatibility, open gear cards ready to go. You can get AK off the camera, no problem.
Jim Jachetta (19:53):
A good question came up pertains to this slide. Someone was asking if a new camera comes out, how long does it take you to develop a compatible version of the SilverBack or this tech with the four, 12 GS would solve that? Or I imagine camera control, a new camera comes out maybe it’s got some proprietary version of control, what have you seen?
Jesse Foster (20:21):
It hasn’t been an issue like a new camera comes out, really it fitment is really something we need to make sure that we don’t obscure any connections or anything just to make sure on the physical realm, but air uses a cap protocol for control for their systems, but that just runs over Ethernet. So if they make any changes onto themselves and their protocol or anything, it’s really just Ethernet to us. So it’s really not an issue on that regard. I think power might become more and more of a point of interest as these cameras and ancillary motors and everything get more power hungry, we actually have a new… so there’s a version… relative of this [inaudible 00:21:14].
Jesse Foster (21:13):
It’s the hybrid universal transceiver SMPTE elimination device for studio cameras, we actually connected to a Sony studio camera, then go single mode fiber, then go back to the hybrid realm using these HUT products. But we have a new one called the HUT-APE, which is 300 volt DC. And we have a power supply that will dock to the SilverBack itself, and then integrate to it and allow you to power 24 volt cameras, and hire consumption rigs using this new SilverBack, APE adapter. So I think that evolutionarily, I mean, that’s really what we see as like the main hurdle to get over early soon is power, but connectivity, and control, and reference, and everything. That all seems to be a constant or within our capabilities. We haven’t gotten thrown by a new camera type.
Jim Jachetta (22:13):
So a traditional studio camera draws more power so you’d use the HUT to feed that type of camera, that kind of setup?
Jesse Foster (22:23):
I think that is true they do. But these, I just mentioned that just because it’s a relative of… it works just like this.
Jim Jachetta (22:31):
It’s very similar. Okay.
Jesse Foster (22:33):
Very similar, imagine this is a Sony CCU and this is a Sony camera over here. It’s like the same concept, but-
Jim Jachetta (22:40):
Another question, and I think I know the answer to it, but I’ll ask you, so do you guys make an RCP or common? If I’m using Sony cameras, if I’m a Sony video engineer, I want the Sony joystick, you interface with the manufacturers RCP-
Jesse Foster (23:02):
Jim Jachetta (23:02):
… seamless. You don’t have to use a special RCP or-
Jesse Foster (23:06):
Jim Jachetta (23:06):
Do you provide RCPs if somebody doesn’t want to use the Sony, are there certain RCPs that are compatible with this setup?
Jesse Foster (23:13):
So we’re agnostic, but we are capable. So like the Sony uses RS 422 legacy S 700 protocol for the Venice. That’s the 8 pin Hirose that everybody’s familiar with, you just run that right through us by directional control. No problem. Absolutely. And then majority of others are migrating to Ethernet. Like Sony FX9 uses Ethernet control and other systems that use link. We support link as well, for some of the FX9 uses link if you don’t want to use Ethernet. So you have to get XTCA, adapter from Sony to get Ethernet.
Jim Jachetta (23:57):
You also mentioned a camera control system on one of the other slides Skaarhoj.
Jesse Foster (24:05):
Jim Jachetta (24:05):
How do you pronounce that? S-K-A-A-R-H-O-J.
Jesse Foster (24:08):
Jim Jachetta (24:08):
Jesse Foster (24:10):
Jim Jachetta (24:14):
I’ll practice that later. But so you do integrate with third party if you can’t afford the Sony setup or the Panasonic CCU, you can use other third parties as long as they use a protocol that we’re piping through the Ethernet or link or the Sony protocol et cetera?
Jesse Foster (24:36):
Jim Jachetta (24:37):
Okay. Very good.
Jesse Foster (24:39):
We are ready to go for all that. So now let’s go to transition into the bigger scope of camera connectivity from multi nine, for example, Panasonic, as you see here, this UE150 PTZ camera, they can match that to the VariCam LT and give you the comparable look from each camera. So you can use them in the same production together, and you could put this PTZ in a position where you can’t get an operator and obviously, right now it’s just-
Jim Jachetta (25:12):
They can make it match close enough to a VariCam, it’s not obvious. You’re not on the VariCam anymore.
Jesse Foster (25:19):
Yeah. They can make the looks match. And Sony everybody’s got that or they’re working towards it as well between their different divisions. But the beauty there is we can bring that fiber connectivity out to whatever camera platform you’re using simultaneously all in the same deployment. So this is an example using the HCP50 from Sony for high frame rate acquisition, the VB box is a customizable throw down unit that has bracketry that can integrate right to a tripod head or whatever type of robotic head you might be using. And then you can populate the VB exactly as you need it. So this camera’s got four SDIs to get you that high frame rate, it’s got genlock, populate the genlocks and some tally, and then you’re going to do control over Ethernet, just build that VB box to specifically meet the application. And it’s extremely popular for us on that level.
Jim Jachetta (26:23):
So this is configurable when you order it, you buy the little box that populated the way you need it?
Jesse Foster (26:30):
Yeah, so we have a new tool on our website now, it’s a VB config tool. So you can go on there and pick exactly what you want in which direction, and we’ll give you a part number. And if you register, it’ll get your price and a rear plane elevation. A very, very popular product for us, but it’s a similar technology that’s in the Silverback, but it’s in a different form factor for application specific needs. So you see it’s very capable on signal types, and this is a growing list, but that’s what’s available today. And then going down the next element I wanted to bring up is the OG 4,600 series, which is 12G capable, and then we have the OG 3,600 series, which is 3G capable. But what this card is doing for us is allowing the receive side, the truck, the Flypack, the control room, the rack room to use open gear for the high density, enhanced cooling.
Jesse Foster (27:29):
You have your remote control and monitoring with dashboard redundant power S and MP, all kinds of good stuff comes with the open gear. So we’ve been working hard to integrate compatibility with our whole platform. So you see here’s the digital cinema stuff up. Here’s the PTZ outside broadcast for like EFP E&G production, our VF 9,000 high density transport. And then here’s the VB in just a throw down with the battery on it, for example. And then the big light box field fiber systems are also compatible with the open gear product.
Jim Jachetta (28:06):
So that one card replaces the full one rack… well, half of the capability of the big rack Mount receiver?
Jesse Foster (28:15):
Jim Jachetta (28:15):
And that’s based with that. So for high density, you’re saving a lot of space there.
Jesse Foster (28:20):
Yeah. I’ll show you on this next slide here, but this is like snapshot. This is the SilverBack connectivity as well. You have your four videos, you have all that audio Ethernet, serial genlock all the Same. And we could also get Intercom through there with some external converters as well. So this genlock you had just mentioned, so this is actually a current project that we have with Google and you can fit 10 of these cards in a 2RU frame, and have 10 PTZ deployments per 2RU frame. So it’s extremely high density with all of the enhancements that Open Gear gives you.
Jesse Foster (29:01):
And then just to touch on some of the other things that might be of interest to everybody. We have our throw down converters these are used, we got dual 12G transmit and dual receive and single transceive. So these are used on POV cameras and occasional use throw down 12GDAS. So it’s a nice range of products there. Audio monitors not so much necessarily in single acquisition, but something that’s popular that we have that I wanted to make sure it was aware of. This is that SMPTE fiber HUT product that this plugs into the Base Station, the CCU from Sony or Panasonic, converts it to single mode fiber.
Jesse Foster (29:54):
You run that single mode fiber to this box, and then this powers the camera. So very single to the juice. This is a fun one here, wavelength shifting Mxs, so we could actually take in any wavelength of fiber and then convert it to a CW Down wavelength. So we could take in say 18, 13, 10 nanometer low cost transmitters and put those over one fiber for you and give them back to you on the other side individually. Our silver bullets, very popular for camera use as well. Open Gear compression products come in shortly, field fibrous is that bulldog I mentioned earlier that VF 9,000 high density transport, and then the camera adapter.
Jim Jachetta (30:38):
Very cool. That’s a great slide. You guys make a lot of cool stuff.
Jesse Foster (30:42):
We do. It’s exciting times and there’s more cool stuff to come, but that’s essentially what I wanted to cover was that enabling piece right now in the industry for all these different camera manufacturers to be deployed in a multi cam live environment. We’re the guys right now. So it’s a pretty exciting time. I’m going to be at Cine Gear early June. Was it the 9th? I think through the 12th in booth B 300, we’ll have this system, SilverBack will be there. So please come by and say hi, and ask me any questions you may have
Jim Jachetta (31:25):
Is Frank coming out to that? Or are you just doing the show alone or you and Matt?
Jesse Foster (31:30):
I think it’s up into air on who else is gone. I’m definitely the one guy right now, but we’ll see who else is coming out.
Jim Jachetta (31:38):
Well, you’re not doing it the paramount lot anymore. So no in and out. I mean, there’s in it that maybe that’s why Frank’s not coming if there’s [crosstalk 00:31:47]
Jesse Foster (31:47):
I did one with [crosstalk 00:31:53] when I first did it 18 years ago or whatever was at the back lot of universal. That was-
Jim Jachetta (32:02):
Oh, really? That predates me.
Jesse Foster (32:03):
Yeah. That was cool. Then it went to the Federal VA grounds. Nobody could have any beer or anything. So that was the worst. But we’ll see what happens.
Jim Jachetta (32:14):
I remember when the In-N-Out burger opened in Vegas, we [inaudible 00:32:21] does Frank still do that? You guys get off the plane at one o’clock in the morning for any, you got to go get in and out [crosstalk 00:32:27] not conscious now?
Jesse Foster (32:29):
Yeah. The house I just moved from in LA had a IN-N-Out on the corner. It was 1973. You could smell it in my backyard, so I’m always like-
Jim Jachetta (32:42):
Oh man, that would be horrible for me.
Jesse Foster (32:42):
Yeah. But I’m in Texas now. So I’m a Whataburger man. That’s [inaudible 00:32:45]
Jim Jachetta (32:45):
Oh, it’s Whataburger in Texas?
Jesse Foster (32:47):
Jim Jachetta (32:47):
Got to check it out. Well, I think that that’s it. We had some good questions, but you already answered those. So everyone give us about a week. We did three, half hour, 20 minute sessions this week. So we’re going to edit those, produce those. So I would say inside of a week, we’ll have all these recordings up. Cindy, put a link to book a meeting with me if you have an immediate need or immediate question, or we can bring Jesse into the conversation for sure. Thank you so much Jesse, and watch out for that hail in Dallas. You cam use special wax so the hail doesn’t dent the car or what do you do?`
Jesse Foster (33:35):
So far I’ve just been hiding it in my garage, but then…
Jim Jachetta (33:38):
Yeah. [crosstalk 00:33:40]
Jesse Foster (33:38):
A mattress in it.
Jim Jachetta (33:41):
Good luck buddy. And see you soon. I’ll probably walk Cine Gear, so I’ll definitely see you there. And thank you for being here, and say hi to everyone. Say hi to my brother.
Jesse Foster (33:52):
I will. Thanks for having us.
Jim Jachetta (33:54):
[inaudible 00:33:54] buddy. Thanks Cindy.
Jesse Foster (33:55):
Thank you. Bye Cindy. Bye everybody.